Tati Gabrielle is giving Marienne Bellamy the happy ending and closure she deserves in the fifth and final season of You. All episodes of the series are streaming on Netflix, and this conversation will contain spoilers.

In the epic fifth and final season, Joe Goldberg returns to New York to enjoy his happily ever after… until his perfect life is threatened by the ghosts of his past and his own dark desires.

I caught up with the actress over Zoom to talk about the impact of her character’s words, what she hopes women who watch the show take away from it, why it was important for Marienne to return one last time, the beauty of her ending, and more. Keep reading for everything we discussed!

I can’t even tell you how much I appreciate you doing this. I started covering the show when you joined, and I’ve spoken with you throughout every season since. I just could not fathom ending my coverage without speaking with you one last time about your character. 
Tati Gabrielle: I appreciate that. I really appreciate that, and you know, I’m always happy to come back and talk to you. 

Despite only making a brief return this season, I truly believe you have two of the most powerful scenes in the entire series. Marienne’s speech about how Joe is an abuser, specifically the part about how much more protective she is of her daughter now, was incredible. I mean, it reminds us that not only is she a woman who went through this, but she is also a mother with a changed perspective. Can you break down what that moment was like to film with Penn in the cage, especially since Joe still believes that he saved her? 
It was so wild. I had a lot going on, I think, emotionally, too, at the time, just in life, and that definitely charged it a lot as well. To be able to be the one to finally say this to him of like, “No, you are so delusional,” and Penn, the amazing actor that he is, I was sort of talking to him about this this morning of he did this incredible thing of dissociation as Joe that I sort of got to feel in season four, but even more so here and the frustration of both Marienne and me feeling his sort of rejection to what I’m saying and it being infuriating of, like, you still have this [delusion], it was felt so keenly in my body. There were takes that I know we did that I slammed on the glass and everything that it was just, like, oh, God, it was an incredible thing to do. 

And then, especially with saying that, because Dallas and I, the girl who played my daughter in seasons three and four, we have such a close relationship still, I’m very close with her and her mom. I’ve been watching Dallas grow up, and so, to say these words and to internalize them in that way as well, I don’t have kids of my own, but Dallas is the closest thing that I guess I have to that. Thinking about that she is, her mom sends me photos and videos of her all the time, and she’s getting all grown, and I can only imagine if I was an actual mother, what that would feel like and that level of fear to know what happened to you, to not be able to share that with your daughter and it’s like, that she says too, the resent she feels for me with how overprotective I am. But it’s like, how can you not be? Yeah, I hope that answers your question ‘cause it was a wild experience filming that scene. 

I want to see the outtakes. Who do we have to talk to? 
Right? I want to see it too ‘cause part of it, I don’t even remember. I was just so raging, just like, oh yeah!

Not only were you the right actress to do it, but also the character to do it. I was thrilled that you got that moment, and Marienne is really the reason that Bronte opens her eyes to who Joe is, which is such a crucial thing this season. We know what that means for Bronte, but what does it mean for Marienne to get that off her chest? I feel that, along with maybe helping her heal, it’s going to help women heal who feel stupid or that it’s too late because of decisions they’ve made regarding bad relationships.
I think for Marienne, honestly, it was even Marienne talking to me. We do think, as women, that we can’t turn ourselves around and that we’re doomed; the world has told us that. And so, I think for Marienne, it very much was, yes, she was talking to Bronte, but she’s still in her healing process. Seeing Joe was still part of that healing process. I think that before that point, years had passed, that she thought that she was in a more solid place and even started that scene with Joe in a stronger place and got broken down, and was like, wow, this took a toll more than I can even [imagine].

She was trying to, I think, remind both herself and Bronte, we still have time, we are alive. As long as you’re living, it’s not too late. It’s like, you get up every day and you try again, and if you fail again, you try again, because to give up on yourself, you’ve now given the world permission to give up on you. I think Marienne, in her stance of knowing what the sort of cards she was dealt through life in general, that she refuses, refuses — oh, that makes me emotional [to think about] — to give up on herself because the world had already given up on her so many times. 

You led me into my next question so perfectly, because we’ve discussed how Marienne is not only a testament to women, but specifically women of color, and the natural fighting and survival instincts that we’re born with. How does it feel to have your character be such a key part of justice finally being served when it comes to Joe after so many seasons? 
Yeah, I feel really honored to be a part of that. When I knew that that was going to be the case for Marienne, it made me feel a lot of relief, not only for myself, for women that are like me, that look like me, but relief for Marienne as well that she gets to see it through to the end, because if she had had to sit back and sort of watch it all unfold, I feel like a part of her would have felt undone, like that part that doesn’t receive closure, and I think that it would have been much harder to sew that part back together and heal properly without being a part of that instance. 

So, I hope that all the women that do watch this, find some sense of, even if it’s just a mustard seed of hope or a mustard seed of courage to, if they’re in a situation to get out of it, if they’ve been down on themselves for something that they’ve been through to remember that we were dealt, as women of color, such a terrible hand [and are] continued to be. The state of our world is scary, even still at the moment and so knowing that, especially with that scene with Bronte, if we band together, like, yes, Bronte is not a woman of color, but just in the grander scheme of women together and particularly women of color together, we are so much more powerful together than we are apart. If we could please stop with the tit for tat or whatever, stop doing the things that men have put on us to sort of sow division between us, let’s stop doing that. Not just for Instagram, not just for the whatever of it, it’s like, I scream, don’t stand back on it, don’t just go behind a keyboard and do it.

Whatever you can in action, whether it’s talking to another woman, whether it’s going outside and acting, whether it’s a conversation you’ve been needing to have with somebody, have that conversation, have the hard conversations to yourself and to everybody else. That’s where change comes from. That’s where we grow from are the hard conversations, and honestly, Marienne doing that, that whole piece even reignited that in me and taught me something in that of like, wow, and you can do it with love. Marienne gave that sentiment to Bronte with love. After Bronte had been told by everybody else in this really aggressive fashion, like, “What are you doing? He’s crazy,” blah, blah, blah. But like, with love, look, we got got and that’s okay — we can forgive ourselves, and that’s the first step on the path to the next.

That answer is why I love talking with you so much, I have chills right now. I’ve been so happy to see you continually come back since season three, but did you know from how things ended last season that you would be returning for the final season? Was that a conversation? And since you were only in one episode, did you get to view the rest of the season as a fan? 
Yes! So no, I did not know that I was coming back. I was hopeful. I was very, very hopeful, but I did not know for sure until the call came, and yeah, I am happy. I want to watch the finale tomorrow with everybody else because I haven’t watched the finale yet. 

It’s so good. Do you know the ending? 
I do know the ending, but it’s one thing to hear it and another thing to actually see it. Yeah, I’m excited to do that because I was a huge fan of the show before getting on it, so to be able to sort of get that experience full circle is kind of special.  

Well, you have to share your thoughts somehow. We have to connect, and you have to tell me what you think.
Okay, if anything, I’ll get on and be like, “Sophia, here are my thoughts, you know who you are.”

In the montage at the end, we find out that Kate is championing Marienne’s work as an artist, which I loved. She has stopped fearing exposure, and there’s a beautiful quote included: “The world sees her talent, loves her.” What does that mean to you? 
For me, well, it means everything to me that it means so much for Marienne, that she finally gets to be seen the way that she has wanted to be, the way she thought Joe saw her, the way that she sort of stressed and pined for her whole, whole life, that she gets to rest peacefully in herself and shine the way that she worked so hard to be able to. Yeah, it means a lot to me, I couldn’t have asked for a better ending for her in that way, that not only did she get closure, but that she got to be her whole self again and yeah, the fight that we’ve seen her go through to get that is just beyond. 

I can genuinely say this final season would not have worked without you and Marienne. Again, thank you for doing this and always making the time to speak with me. I’m so proud of you and am constantly cheering you on. I hope we get to do this again super soon. Congratulations. 
Thank you, Sophia. It’s always, always a pleasure. Thank you so, so much. 

Every time I see your name [with a project], it’s over.
No, same thing. I was like, “Oh my God, Sophia!” I feel that.